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 Post subject: 1 Getting To Know Your Men Better
PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 1:27 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 6:44 pm
Posts: 464
Location: Playing In the Sandbox
Getting To Know Your Men Better.

One of the things that you can do to help yourself is to look a lot harder at the units you have and
learn more about them. While I do not expect new players to C&C to jump on this. Knowing what
units have higher Exp and better Morale as well as which ones actually do have a radio is something
that more experienced players can use to obtain the best performance from the units they have. It
means a whole lot more micro management then most players want to do. But we are playing a
game of number crunching here and if you can stack the deck in your favor by being more aware of
each units equipment loads and there actual skill levels you can use that to assign them tasks better
suited to the skills and equipment they have. It is very much a case of getting to know the men
under your command vs just jumping out of a jeep and yelling orders at a bunch of guys you do not
know anything about. It's about taking command of the forces and putting them to best use based
on the capability's they have. Not just sending out a platoon which you have assumed to be just as
capable of the next platoon you send out. There is a way to take advantage of the units that have
better numbers if your willing to spend the time to do it.

Lets look again at two of the things I showed the new players to look at and look a bit harder at them
then they will. Below is the Roster of a small force. Take a look at the Exp and Mor columns and
note that some of these guys are a lot more skilled or have a lot higher morale then others. If you
take the time to note these differences you can spend time assigning them to a leader who also has a
higher set of skills. This will allow you to build a better platoon. It also means you will have a platoon
of slackers and cowards. But when the fighting starts and you want to send in a platoon that you can
count on to get the job done you want your best men on that task not just any old platoon. When
the time comes to send out a platoon to what you know is probably going to be certain death and you
don't need them to be heroes just cannon fodder. Who are you going to send your best men? An
average platoon? Or a platoon of idiots you would rather see sent to the stockade.


This is just a small list. When you have several company's or more independent platoons and
sections to look at you will see that some of the squads you have are outright supermen and others
are a waste of a uniform. No where is it written that you can not use the Assign a unit to a New HQ
button to move them around to maximize the ability of these men. This is how Elite units are
made. They get rid of the men who can not cut it and keep only the best men. You may not have
units that are classed as Elite in game terms but you can sure do something to make the best of what
you do have. IF you spend the time to do it. The bad news here is that most of that time will be at
a point where you can not save the game and have to not only gather this information but make use
of it before you can finish the game set up and save it. It has to be done during the deployment
phase of the game. That is the only time this can be done.


In the Picture above we see we have even more information about this unit then was available in the
Roster. We can tell if the squad in question has a radio and we can see what his possible
Command numbers are if the HQ it has is killed and this unit is asked to take its place. We can also
see more information about the ammo load out this squad has in the way of squad Mg and
grenades. If your squads have items like satchel charges you will know which ones have the most
and who will be the ones you want to hold back to take out that bunker you know is out there. That
squad is much more important then the squad who as only has 1 of those sort of weapons. If you let
them go out and get killed before you have utilized them who is at fault?

If you are willing to take the steps necessary to use this information you will already be doing
something most players are not going to do. You are making the effort now to be the better player
not just a player.


 Post subject: Re: 1 Getting To Know Your Men Better
PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 9:15 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 07, 2009 11:47 pm
Posts: 8
Location: Who cares?
I actually have been doing this; cherry-picking a formation til I have at least a platoon of "go to" guys for the tougher jobs or situations, but haven't posted about it because I thought the only one **** enough to do it was me. I stand corrected. Haven't got enough experience to form an opinion yet, however; some direction may be in order. Of the various stats; experience, morale, rally and leadership which do you lend more credence to? I lean towards morale personally. Maybe add 'em all together and divide for an average? I welcome any and all views on this subject.

 Post subject: Re: 1 Getting To Know Your Men Better
PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 10:28 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 6:44 pm
Posts: 464
Location: Playing In the Sandbox
I personally put more into the Experience. Morale can be altered with the purchase of other units
Experience can not.

Experience is what gives the units its skills they will shoot better, spot better, and in general do
everything better including stay hidden and take incoming fire better. I feel experience is more
important when attacking. I want them to do what it takes to win. I can live with them running
from a bad spot since I can rally them and send them back in latter. Rally attempts I can accept
poor performance is just not going to get it.

Morale as I said can be altered by the use of command tents and hospital units that boost morale
and increase rally chances. For me Morale is more important when I am defending. I need my
units to hold as long as possible. This is not to say I won't use a reserve full of the higher
experience units to counter attack. While not completely true these units don't boost morale as
such they do reduce suppression which is a big part of what morale does. I see less suppression
as a boost to morale.

When it comes time to shift units into the Alpha platoon (the one with only the best of the best)
I use experience as the main trait to accepting a unit. However low morale is a reason to take
even the best unit and toss them out. So even if a unit is good if his morale is low he is not
going to be able to do the tasks under fire with out needing lots of rally attempts aimed at him.
I would rather see that unit put in a less stressful place perhaps as the #1 squad in an average
platoon. (just in case the HQ dies) These Alpha troops end up with the best HQ I can give to
them too. For the troops I look at Exp and Morale. For the HQ I look at the command rates

The slackers end up either spread out or in a platoon of there own. They get the job of being
cannon fodder. They are going to die and I would rather lose them then a better unit. So they
are going to be a lead unit in a attack to soak up the first op fires or the guys that get sent in
to the deep dark woods to clear it. Knowing full well that they are doing recon by the Ray
Charles method (they bump into it and it shoots back at them) They found it.... If they can do
the mission all the better for me. If they fail oh well they were not asked to do anything that
was considered critical to my overall plan.

Its worth doing. This is a game that uses math to resolve the combat. If your not going to
stack the deck in your favor it is no ones fault but your own if your units can't do the job.

I don't play many games any more with C&C off. If I am going to spend the time to do the
work necessary to plan and set up a serious battle I might as well spend the time to go all the
way. I would rather play 1 game that takes 2 months in which I have invested a lot of time and
take seriously, then play 3 fast games at 20 turns that I just don't put much into due to lack of
interest. It's not fair to the other player. So I stick to my serious C&C games now.

One of the biggest units that will need moved to a new HQ are your mortars. It makes no sense
to have them working for an HQ that has a low Arty Rating. Move them to the Foo or give them
to a unit with a high Arty rating. Then give that HQ something he can use like Mg's or ATR's

Again it is a case of stacking the deck to get the math working for you. Every little bit adds to
the end result. Better preforming units.


 Post subject: Re: 1 Getting To Know Your Men Better
PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 11:54 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 07, 2009 11:47 pm
Posts: 8
Location: Who cares?
I appreciate your views and your philosophy on this. If as many players as I suspect have titles such as Squad Leader and Tobruk in their past I can't see why you wouldn't want to take the time for these things, since you don't have to spend time on the 15,000 modifiers and dice rolls of the board sims. This may sound weird but I feel that we owe it to the people we are trying to portray in these sims to at least get as close as we can to outcomes based in reality. I don't play because I think I'm another Balcke, Patton or Auchinleck but because I love history, especially the military history of that era.

 Post subject: Re: 1 Getting To Know Your Men Better
PostPosted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 12:26 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 6:44 pm
Posts: 464
Location: Playing In the Sandbox
I was a Tobruk fan, Never went to Squad leader since I couldn't find anyone willing to play it.
But when SSI came out with Overrun and Typhoon of Steel I was all over that and then SP
and Harpoon came out. I was a happy camper. Then came the Flight sims. AH-64 and
F-18. But the whole time SP was always on the HD. I never got serious about it until a few
years back and ever since then I have tried to make the games I play as close to realistic play
as the game allows. now I am pushing it to the limits with maps and methods of play
since there is little more that can be done with the units themselves.

Between doing stuff for the Civil war mod and Nam mod I am working on a system of play
that somewhat models the campaign game style of play. Testing shows it is possible but
there is no good way to "upgrade" units you so really don't progress through the war like
in the campaign style but you progress from battle to battle with a core force with limited
points to buy aux units and repair damaged and destroyed units.

I will be looking for play testers and the requirements will be C&C play with LC Settings
and the ability to enter simple data in a spreadsheet program used to control the points
and record the results. Lots of possibilities but still the same problem lack of players who
want to get involved in something like this.


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